2B Bolder Podcast (Transcript)- Episode 3
Featuring Patty Kleckner
Episode Title: #3 Career Podcast Featuring Patty Kleckner, Executive Director, and Licensed Nursing Home Administrator : Women in Business
Host: Mary Killelea
Guest: Patty Kleckner
Mary Killelea (Host): Hi there. My name is Mary Killelea. Welcome to the To Be Bolder podcast, providing career insights for the next generation of women in business and tech. To Be Bolder was created out of my love for technology and marketing, my desire to bring together like-minded women, and my hope to be a great role model and source of inspiration for my two girls and other young women like you. Encouraging you guys to show up and to be bolder and to know that anything you guys dream of, it's totally possible. On To Be Bolder, you're going to hear inspiring stories of how successful women, some I know, some I just want to bring to you guys, and they're going to talk about their careers in business and tech, and they're going to tell us their stories about their passion and their journey and their challenges, and we're going to learn some of their advice along the way too. So, sit back, relax, and enjoy the conversation.
Hi, everyone. Today's guest is Patty Kleckner, a woman I have admired for years, not only because she is a good, caring mom, balancing life with a career like me, but she is a kind and funny human being. And when I say kind, I mean she is very kind. She is a great tennis player, and I recently picked up tennis for the first time, I think it was last summer, and we entered a tennis tournament together. And I know it was killing you, Patty, that whole time we did our match. But you were nothing but encouraging and supportive to me that whole time. So, I thank you. Patty has worked for Marquis Companies for the past 20 years. She is executive director and a licensed nursing home administrator at Marquis Companies. Welcome to the show, Patty. Thank you for being here.
Patty Kleckner (Guest): Thank you, Mary. That was a really nice introduction. And I was not, you played tennis really great, and I was happy to be your partner.
Mary Killelea:That's very kind of you. But we haven't played since, you know that, right?
Patty Kleckner: Well, yeah. Nothing against you. I just haven't played. So you were a great partner. So I would play another tournament with you if I played.
Mary Killelea: Okay, I'm gonna hold you to that.
Patty Kleckner: Okay.
Mary Killelea: Okay, so I can't adequately begin to cover all your roles over the years. So please tell everyone a little bit about your current role and what that 20 year journey with Marquis has looked like.
Patty Kleckner: Well, I'm an executive director. And what that means is I'm in charge of total operations for a nursing rehab facility. And so and then we have an assisted living that's attached to us. And so, when people maybe have a stroke or maybe hip fracture, they come to stay with us for short stay less than about 20-25 days, and they get physical therapy, occupational therapy, and feet and nursing. And then and it's a highly regulatory industry. It's the second most regulated industry next to nuclear science. And so, there's a lot of regulations, federal, state, OSHA, Fire Marshal, you name it, we're regulated by it. So, I'm in charge of all the regulations and the financial outcomes of the building as well.
Mary Killelea: Wow, I had no idea it was that stringent of what did you say it was second to?
Patty Kleckner: Nuclear engineering, second most regulated industry next to nuclear engineering. Yeah. So we have the state and federal surveyors come in on an annual basis, and or on a complaint basis. So in a normal facility, they could come in, the state surveyors could come in two to three times a year and look at your total care of all the patients that you've served over the over the year, and do citations if they see any anything that went against the regulation. So.
Mary Killelea: Wow, that's..
Patty Kleckner: Highly regulatory. Yeah.
Mary Killelea: So, how did you end up here? And when you started out your career, did you have this and your current role as your goal?
Patty Kleckner: Well, I might date myself here, but I graduated from college and I started into the sales world of selling pagers and I had Nike account, Intel account, I had a bunch of different accounts and I was very, very successful in that. And I loved it. But I was interested in in health care sales. And kind of roundabout way I ended up doing marketing for a rehab facility. And I had this great mentor. Her name was Diane Richardson, and she was an administrator and she really, I just loved her way of caring for the patient and all the things that she was responsible for. And so that's how I got into becoming an administrator. It's a training program that you have to go through. And then you have to pass the federal and the state exam to become a licensed administrator. And so that's the path I took. And then my first building that I ran was one of the largest facilities in Oregon at the time was 175 beds facility with a pediatric chronically ill unit and a gerosike unit. And so I ran that building and I would never recommend that for a brand new administrator. But I did a lot, I learned a lot. And that that company was Generations, which was a lovely company. But then they sold to Marquis. And so that's how I became a Marquis administrator. And that was almost 20 years ago that I started working for Marquis. And I just really appreciate Marquis and their support of the administrators that because we do we need a lot of support from just a lot of different angles of how do we make sure that we're in compliance? And how do we make sure we're driving the financial outcomes, positive outcomes for that. So Marquis has been a company that I've learned from and grown with a lot.
Mary Killelea: That's wonderful. So is there such a thing as a typical day? And if so, what would that look like for you?
Patty Kleckner: That's what I actually love about my job is there's not a typical day. I mean, I have regular meetings, but it's healthcare. So it's always coming different angles, everything. I oversee our human resources. I'm interacting with staff all the time. We have staff that are entry level, and then we have staff that are clinical nurses, nurse practitioners, and then doctors. And so I can go from an interaction with a CNA that just started in this industry to talking to a doctor within 10 minutes. And that variety is very fun. And I just learned from each person that I come into contact with. And I love the collaboration that we do to get good outcomes for our patients and get them home safely and have them really be happy with their stay with us. So, if they're only there for 10 days, then if they think, wow, I could go back to Marquis because it was a great stay, that's the best outcome. So my day is surrounded by that. So I review the medical charts for everyone. The last 24 hours, I review it with my team, I make sure that we're going in the right direction with each patient that we care for. There's a variety of diagnosis that I deal with. And I wasn't clinical from college, but I really enjoyed that piece. And so probably half my job is clinical. And so we have that meeting. And then I go about my day of either dealing with the financial piece or recruiting for our team. And going from maintenance of the building to computers, because our medical chart is electronic. And so did we have a computer problem or something? So I really have a different day every day. So there's people that really specialize in HR and different things, but because I'm in charge of operations, I, I touch everything, every component of running a building. So it makes it fun and never a dull day.
Mary Killelea: Yeah, I don't know how you ever get a day off.
Patty Kleckner: Yes. Well, that is, yeah, we are administrators are on call 24/7. And but once you get your building going and in the right direction, , the on call kind of goes away because your staff know what to expect from you and what you expect from them. And so when you first take over a building, you might get a lot of calls because they're just making sure they're doing what is in line with you. But then after a while, it calms down quite a bit. So I maybe get a call on off hours. I don't know, maybe once or twice a month.
Mary Killelea: Oh, that's not that bad.
Patty Kleckner: So not that bad.
Mary Killelea: So you mentioned you had a mentor. I believe you said Diane. Is that correct?
Patty Kleckner: Yeah, Diane, Diane Richardson.
Mary Killelea: So did you, did she know she was mentoring you at the time? Did you outreach to her and say, Hey, I'm hungry for a career in this field and you inspire me or how did that relationship come to be?
Patty Kleckner: Well, she hired me for the marketing and admissions, and I didn't have an interest. I had more of an interest in going into sales for medical supplies. So I wanted to get that medical experience. But through, I worked for her about three years. I just really enjoyed watching her run a building and she was one of the highest accreditations you could get is it was the only facility in Oregon that she had the accreditation. And so she was very successful administrator. And so about a year into my job, I expressed to her that I was interested in it. And she's super excited because she thought I had some assets that could really lend to being a good administrator. And she helped me develop and gave me insight to what she was doing and why she was doing it. And it was really nice to kind of get her information. She had been in the industry for a long time. She was actually a nurse that became an administrator. So that's where I got my clinical kind of interest because she had such a clinical eye to be being an administrator. So she was very strict administrator. So I learned some of that as well. But when you become your own administrator for a building, you kind of take on your own personality. But I learned just the process and systems are so important to quality care that that was probably the biggest takeaway that I had from her.
Mary Killelea: That's wonderful. Who in, mentoring is one thing and then you've got life inspiration. So who in your life has been the biggest inspiration to guide you as a business woman? Or I think as like six, there's something that drives each of us as individuals to be successful, whether that's your parent, whether it's a teacher, besides mentors who actually help you shape you for a specific role. Who would you say has inspired you?
Patty Kleckner: I would say, I don't know if this is the angle, but my grandma, I was really close with her when she was, when I was younger and she helped take care of me. And she was born and raised in a Pia, Samoa, and didn't know any English. And she came over to the States and she just taught me she just taught me the respect of the elderly and how to have fun with the elderly. We would have slumber parties. She would sleep on the floor with me. She was like 75 years old. And I think that is probably my biggest driver of why I do the job I do. And so when someone comes in and scared to be in a facility and I just go to that thought of my grandma and how I would treat my grandma if she was there. And so she was probably my biggest hero and inspiration to, and I only had 12 years with her. And so, she was probably the biggest impact. And she was the only woman post, post men, post woman in Samoa. And she was the only one of the only women that knew how to drive in Samoa. And I think that level of just independence for a woman really inspired me and it showed me how you can do your own thing. You can be who you want to be. And she had so many people saying, why are you doing that? You're a woman. She would just say, I had to provide for my family and she did. And so, back then unheard of. And so she would tell me stories about it. And, and that was probably my biggest inspiration.
Mary Killelea And I love that, you know, until I think we stop and think about some of these things, we don't realize those silent influences that we have in our lives. I'm sure that, you know, your grandma's obviously, you've thought of this inspiration before, but it's a collection of role models and women throughout our lives that touch our lives, either directly that have impact on us, impact either inspirationally or, you know, maybe even things we don't want to do because we witness it and we see reactions. It's like, it's a learning process. So having role models is fantastic. And I think that's a wonderful story. Okay. So let's talk about challenges. What are some of the challenges that you faced in the past or faced today in your, in your role within the healthcare field or the elderly care field?
Patty Kleckner: Well, it's such a growing industry. I mean, with the baby boomers going into it, it's so many facets to caring for the elderly and reimbursement challenges are always a huge issue. We just went through Medicare's changed our reimbursement models. And it's completely different dynamic change for my whole industry, like across the United States. So that's one of the largest challenges and just reimbursement from HMOs is really hard. There's one HMO that we're currently trying to negotiate with and they haven't adjusted our rates in 10 years. And I have to recruit staff and pay them well in order to keep them. And if your HMO isn't reimbursing you in differently in 10 years, that's a really big challenge. This industry is about on average, about 1% profit. There's some buildings that are not operating in a profitable way. And when you change their reimbursement model, and it could be a very big challenge to be able to operate a building. Our largest expenses, labor. And sometimes we have temporary agency people because it's not the sexiest job to come to. When it's a thriving economy, it's even harder to recruit. So not to say that I want a bad economy, but it does make an impact on us because people tend to go to healthcare because it's more stable when the economy is bad. And when the economy is good, then it's really hard for us to recruit. So in an industry that is about average, 100% turnover in a year that's a big challenge as well. So there's a lot of things that, um, the labor market impacts our every day, that's a challenge for us. And to maintain your team and to have them drive to provide good care to your residents is probably the biggest challenge we face every day.
Mary Killelea: Uh, 100%. That's amazing. And that's really shocking.
Patty Kleckner: Yeah. In every department, it's your dietary, your nursing, your housekeeping, and we've been able to in the last couple of years in my particular facility, take that turnover down to less than 75%. So that's good. So those are good things, but you just have to maintain that every day. You have to be working on recruiting and retaining staff.
Mary Killelea: So I think this might tie into it, but technology is changing almost every business across industry. So how has technology impacted your company in the way that you do your role and the way you do recruiting. Tell me the pros and cons, if you will, around technology. And even if like there is such a thing as digital transformation happening within your organization, I mean, you're very human touch, high touch type of business. So I'm curious.
Patty Kleckner: Well, on the recruiting end, we just implemented within the last few years new recruiting program and new application program that increased our applications from, I like almost a hundred percent because of our application before was so hard to get through that people would give up. And now that it's pretty easy to go through it, it's so nice to have applications actually coming through for staff. And the data that we get from this new program is so nice because we can see how many people were recruiting, how many people are actually looking at our website, how many people are applying for the jobs, where we're actually doing well at recruiting. All that data is coming at us now, which is just fabulous. We haven't had this. And I think we just started this about two years ago. And so when you've been dealing with staff retention and staff recruitment, and you don't have the data, you don't know if you're doing the right thing or not. And for us to see this on a daily basis, monthly basis, quarterly basis is just so nice to see for even moving the bar towards are we doing anything right in our recruitment efforts and our retention efforts?
Other big pieces to my day to day thing is to just see outcomes that are like, oh, we did a indeed ad on this RN, a registered nurse, and we got five applications. That's good. That's a really good ad that we invested in. And that was smart. That's the smartest way to use your money or we didn't get any applications on this other advertisement that we did and let's not do that again. And so we haven't been able to do that. And so, to have that at your fingertips and being able to look at reports is so nice.
Mary Killelea: Do you do that advertising and outreach in-house or have a third party agency that helps you with that?
Patty Kleckner: We do it in-house. We have a recruiting department. It's about, I think, five or six people deep. They help us with recruitment at each site. So, Marquis has about 26 sites plus therapy, plus pharmacy. So, our Marquis facility, we have five people and then Consonus Pharmacy, that's a sister company to us, has recruitment people as well. So, it's probably the whole, all the sister companies for Marquis. I would say there's probably, I don't know, 10 to maybe 15 people recruiting or within that kind of either digital marketing or doing different facets that help us to get our name out there and to get kind of the reason why it'd be, be a Marquis employee, not just come work for us. There's a lot of social media that we're really aggressive about and showing videos of, of what we're about and that's all on social media. So it's really nice to kind of show people this is why you should come work for Marquis, not just, yeah, we have a job. That's gone away.
Mary Killelea: Well, I think it's great to have the data and really begin to understand the ROI on some of your advertising investments. And so and optimizing it, that's the key to the data or using the data. So as regarding technology, do you use technology for patient care?
Patty Kleckner: Yes. Electronic medical record. It's been there for probably 10 years or a little bit less than 10 years. So electronic medical record is used. And we have this program, it's called Co-pilot and it draws information from our medical record and it helps us see any trends of what's going on with our patients to see if there's any things we do quality assurance almost every day. And it shows anything from rehospitalizations, which is hospitals and nursing facilities are penalized for rehospitalizations, people that come to our facility and then go back to the hospital. And it shows that information and shows what their diagnosis was, why they went back and gives us those reports to do a quality assurance and see are we doing things well? Is there a big trend of why a person's going back? Is there education we need to do more for their nurses to help them see signs and symptoms of someone that may need medical, doctor or a nurse practitioner involvement. And to involve them quite quickly so that we can prevent a rehospitalization. So those are all things that gives us, there's data that is given to us and so we can see any and identify any trends.
Mary Killelea: Yeah, I mean, I think the use of technology and how it's impacting everyone's day-to-day life in business is incredible. And I look forward to all the advancements that technology brings to the learning through the data that businesses are getting these days.
Patty Kleckner: Yeah, and it's also like helped us break down silos between the hospital and facility. When I started, we just operated by ourselves and to reach out to a hospital, they would just not respond. And this data has helped us get into the hospitals and say, hey, we are a facility that has a small amount of rehospitalization. This might be a reason that you would refer more patients to us. Those are kind of things that we've been able to, as a marketing perspective, to give them more data, which helps the people that are in leadership in the hospitals understand that we're making an impact and we're working with them collaboratively and trying to prevent any kind of unnecessary rehospitalization. So that's really critical right now in the world of healthcare.
Mary Killelea: Well, and as a person who has aging parents, I'm coming to the years where I'm going to have to be looking after my parents, those are critical things that I would want to be aware of. So I think that's amazing that you have that data.
Patty Kleckner: I call the people in our world, the sandwich people. Yes. It's very challenging and I see it quite a bit that you have children that either in high school, grade school, whatever, and then you have aging parents and it's a big challenge for those kids to manage both. And I appreciate that and I see that and I gravitate to help them because I understand their world. It's challenging.
Mary Killelea: Yeah, I have heard that term before and I totally, it is the world I live in right now. And speaking of life work balance, I know it's unique to each individual and there's no recipe for success. How do you feel you've dealt with life work balance over the years? I know our kids are about the same age, but when they were younger or even today, how do you deal with the pressures of feeling like you're doing enough as a mom to check the box? Like, okay, I'm good mom. And your desire to be a successful business woman because it really fills you up in a way that motherhood can't. How do you keep that balance?
Patty Kleckner: I think it's probably, it is the biggest challenge, for a mom to do. I think that I really focus on when I'm there at work, I'm there, and when I leave, my team understands and I talk to them about what's going on in my world so that they understand that I need to get home at a certain time. I strategically look at my day and organize my day so that I can be home at a relatively normal time to be present with them. I think if you, I mean, this job, you can work 10 hours a day and still not feel like you have everything accomplished. But I think that balance of saying, no, I gotta go home and be at home and still get everything done. I think I always give myself some grace too, because I think you can beat yourself up pretty good if you're a little bit late to the baseball game or volleyball game. And you have to give yourself grace and say, I'm doing the best I can. I'm not a religious person, but I do pray a lot about it and ask God to help me remain in that balance. And I try to exercise. I think that's important to the stress load. And I love to do spin class and those kinds of things to help me just have that balance of health and family and work. The work does fulfill me. When I was in sales, I was only as good as my last sale. And I feel like there's long lasting impact that I make on someone's life. And when they say, this is the best place to come, I'll come back here again if I need this level of care. Those are things that are really fill my cup.
Mary Killelea: Right.
Patty Kleckner: I just try to make sure that I just make it home in time to do the things that are important to my kids. And I do take all my vacation. I used to not when I didn't have kids. And that's a big thing to me. It’s really important to me to make it to their events. If I have to work a little bit after everything's done, the events done, then that's okay. It's the balance that I put on myself and that's okay to me. I don't beat myself up because I may have to do a few email responses in the evening. That's okay. Cause you know I was able to get there for my kids. So I don't know if I'm doing it right, but I feel like I can do it. I'm very involved in my kids high school. I'm on the booster board. I try to get myself just a little bit of involvement in their lives at the school. And so those things are important to me, that time goes by so fast. And so I think that I just need to have a little bit of pepper in there. Like, okay, I have boosters. Okay. I'm going to do concessions. Okay. I'm going to connect with other parents and that's important to me. I think that to be present there and to be seen I think that's important that the kids see me doing that kind of stuff and not an absent parent because I'm working.
Mary Killelea: Yeah, that's wonderful. So what advice would you give the next generation of women who are either in the workforce now or looking for a career change or some, someone who's just starting out and wanting to educate themselves on opportunities in the field of elder care and is there certain training or resume building tips that you would recommend?
Patty Kleckner: I do this mentor program through Oregon State for people that are interested in our field. And I meet with one particular student and for I think it's six months. But the biggest thing I work with them on is knowing. So when people say in an interview, what's your three greatest strengths, I don't think people, when they're coming out of college, I don't think they understand the importance of knowing their strengths because those strengths in the interview goes through every, almost every question. When I ask the people that I'm mentoring, what are your strengths they give the canned message, the canned, oh yeah, I'm organized, but they don't really dive into what their strength is that can really make them a true asset to the company. And they don't drive like what's their passion through their strengths. Does that make sense? I think they don't know their passion and they don't know their true… what they've gone through in life, even if it's 22 years of life, what they've gone through to help them understand what their best qualities are.
Mary Killelea: So, it might be helpful if someone talks about a strength to actually give a tactical example to make it more real and meaningful.
Patty Kleckner: Yeah. And to really dive into themselves to see that. So through this mentor program, I really work with them on at least two sessions to talk to them, to see and this one person gave me their strengths and they were just the canned messages. And I was like, okay, that's great. But then at the end, it was funny because she really flourished when we kind of dove into more of what her true strengths are. She was a person that went back to college after having kids and kind of a second career going back to college. And I said, you're organized, you can handle a job and three kids and those are really important things. She goes, yeah, you're right. I am super organized. I couldn't get any of this done. And it wasn't one of those things that she brought up. And I was like that's a big thing and you can give reasons and meet to the reason why you chose that as one of your greatest strengths. So I think that's a big thing. And what you can really contribute to the company is another thing that I look for when I'm interviewing people I think that I can see their passion behind what they can bring to the company. And there's a lot of people I interview that they don't know much about our company and there's so many things that you can research about our company or any company. I think that shows a lot when you come into an interview that you haven't done your homework on the company. I ask tell me three things about Marquis and that kind of throws them off. And I just think that if you're really interested and invested in that company and working for that company, you would want to take some time to know. I always work in threes. I don't know why, but I just say know three things about the company that the reason why you would want to work for us. And so those are things that to me that shows interest and passion and you're going to be an asset to our company.
Mary Killelea: What about in college? Are there particular and this might be my naiveness, but is there a particular degree that you would get?
Patty Kleckner: There is. At Oregon State, there is a healthcare administration degree and there's actually, other colleges that are starting or have it it for a few years in healthcare administration. I think Concordia and Oregon State are the prominent ones that we recruit from. But you don't have to have that particular degree. I didn't, but I fell into this in a different way. There’s people that have social services degrees. There's a multitude of things that could bring you to our industry. But then I think through becoming a department manager of a certain department within our facility, there's a lot of people that say, hey, I really am interested in becoming an administrator. I really like doing this job or working in this industry. And then they go into our program, what's called an administrator training program. And so that's where we recruit typically from internal because they've been exposed and we do an internship program through Oregon State that you work in each department and learn the departments. And then you become a department head and then you apply for the administrator and training program. So, it's a whole process. We have a big leadership program called Ascend where we identify people that have leadership qualities or are interested in it. And then we expose them to more and more of leadership classes and education at our home office that helps them develop. And then they go into the administrator and training program.
Mary Killelea: Oh, that's fantastic. I love that you have that some built in. That's amazing. And I love the fact that you're participating in the Oregon State mentor program. I didn't know that. So that's really admirable.
Patty Kleckner: Yeah, it's a fun program. I actually really enjoy it. And this is my third person that I'm mentoring and we meet once a month either in person or online. And it just helps us give that person a little bit more direction and helps them. I actually helped the person get a job at another company, not within the same industry, but I knew a person and so I helped them get a job. And so, it was very successful for that person to do the mentor program and they get credits. And so, it's kind of nice that way.
Mary Killelea: That's fantastic. So many women struggle with self-confidence and I personally have had challenges over the years, owning my own business and then going to corporate America. There was some self-confidence issues, insecurities, whatever you want to call them. Have you experienced that personally or what kind of advice do you give others who might be battling with not having the voice at the table and helping them to be able to, to value their contribution and to really show up and shine at work?
Patty Kleckner: It gets intimidating in some levels. You're in front of a doctor and you're trying to advocate for your patient. That can get intimidating, but I really do believe if you do your homework and you know the answer or you know your vision is a big deal, just to see the vision of that conversation or to see, remain, I don't know what the word is loyal to yourself of what you want to get out of that conversation is to me showing that confidence and it's not easy. And when you're a brand new employee or brand new administrator, wow, did I ever learn how to be really present and confident in meetings? And I failed a lot in my first few years and I continue to learn. I don't think I have all the confidence in the world, but I do believe that my passion and my vision are what drive me to be confident. And I don't go away from that. I don't compromise on that. And I think that's a big, important tool to have for a person that is going to be in a leadership role. I think your values, where you want that your particular in my case, my building to go to, and I always keep those in mind when I'm dealing with any kind of situation, whether it be recruitment, employee relation, customer satisfaction and those things, I always think, okay, how would I, I would want to be treated? How would we, if my mom was in this facility, how would I receive that as a family member? And I always think about that. And I think that helps my confidence because I think of the empathy of the situation. And my job is a lot, there's a lot of empathy. There's a lot of trying to see through what, how, what they're dealing with. And nobody knows our industry and when they come into the facility, it's like, Oh my gosh, I saw this on 60 minutes it's all, it's a little bit negative. And so you try to empathize with them. And I think if you know your stuff and what your, like I said, vision and purpose is, I think that helps with your confidence.
Mary Killelea: That's great. So do you have any good books? I know you have a short commute, but do you have any podcasts?
Patty Kleckner: Really short commute. Actually, I'm reading a book. I think one of my biggest ones is that I've read in the company owner is really big on reading. And so to become a leader within your, the company, there's a few books that he wants us to read, which I think is a really good thing to have driven within the company was Good to Great, was a really good one for me to, to kind of just help with leadership. And it was one of probably the more pivotal ones for me. But right now I'm reading Radical Candor from Kim Scott. And it's a really good book. It's a woman's perspective and she works for Amazon and I think Google and a lot of different companies, but she talks a lot about how to get the point across, but to make sure that you're doing it in a positive way and a productive way. So, it's a really good read.
Mary Killelea: Thank you for that one. I have not heard of that one. I'll have to add that. I've read Good to Great and it is good. Alright. Two more questions and then I'll let you go. If you could tell your 20 year old self one thing, what would it be?
Patty Kleckner: I would say to always stay true to yourself and if your intention is good, know that your intention is good in any approach, and you'll do fine.
Mary Killelea: That's excellent advice. So last question, what's next for Patty Kleckner? And that could be next week. It could be five years from now, 10 years from now. It's open to you.
Patty Kleckner: To get my kids through high school and get them to college, that's just always in my mind right now. I have a senior and a sophomore and to have them be happy at their choice of college or not, it's their journey, but to get them through and then to just continue the balance of life with my husband and life at work and with the kids and to just enjoy every moment with the kids as long as I have them in the house. It's just hard to think about the next year. I won't have one of them in the house and I'm just going to have to be there for them. That's my focus right now. And my work is, you know, Marquis has been so kind to me to allow me to focus on both. That's the nice thing. So that's probably, that's what I can think of right now off the top of my head.
Mary Killelea: That's wonderful. Well, Patty, thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much for being here today. It's been a pleasure having you on the show. If someone wanted to connect with you, where could they connect?
Patty Kleckner: LinkedIn.
Mary Killelea: Okay. So just Patty Kleckner. That's your... Yeah. Okay. Perfect. Well, thank you so much. I really, really appreciate it.
Patty Kleckner: Thanks, Mary. This was fun.
Mary Killelea: Thanks for listening to the episode today. It was really fun chatting with my guests. If you liked our show, please like it and share it with your friends. If you want to learn what we're up to, please go check out our website at 2bbolder.com. That's the number two, little b, bolder.com.