Career Growth Advice from Nancy Novak, Data Centers Leader | Career Tips for Women in Data Centers

2B Bolder Podcast – Episode 71
Featuring Nancy Novak, CIO of Compass Datacenters

Episode Title: #71 Career Podcast Featuring a Woman with 30 years Experience in Construction and the current CIO for Compass Datacenters: Women In Business

Host: Mary Killelea
Guest: Nancy Novak



Mary Killelea (Host): Hi there. My name is Mary Killelea. Welcome to the To Be Bolder podcast, providing career insights for the next generation of women in business and tech. To Be Bolder was created out of my love for technology and marketing, my desire to bring together like-minded women, and my hope to be a great role model and source of inspiration for my two girls and other young women like you, encouraging you guys to show up and to be bolder and to know that anything you guys dream of, it's totally possible. So, sit back, relax and enjoy the conversation.

Hi, thanks for tuning in. I am thrilled to have Nancy Novak on the show today. She has over 30 years of experience in the construction industry. Nancy brings extensive expertise in oversight and responsibility for profit and loss. In her current role as chief innovation officer for Compass Data Centers, her focus is cutting edge technology, lean practices and innovative culture through diversity of thought to add value, improve return on investment and disrupt the construction industry. She is the host of Breaking Glass podcast, which features Nancy's dynamic conversations with prominent women in the technology industry. A forum where these accomplished women offer insights, advice and inspiration that listeners can apply to their own professional lives. Nancy, thank you for being on this show and sharing your career story and insights with our listeners. I'm so happy you're here.

Nancy Novak (Guest): I'm so thrilled to be here. I look forward to a really engaging conversation. I appreciate you thinking of me, Mary.

Mary Killelea: Of course, of course. Okay, so you have a rich career. Walk us through at a high level how you got to where you are today.

Nancy Novak: So at a high level, I would have to say it starts with my dad, who is who was a general superintendent on a global scale with a very large firm back in the day. And what he would do is he would have to travel to and from the job sites and sometimes live away from us. And so, we would go visit with him. And of course, while we're visiting, we need something to do. And I say we – it's me and my twin sister – both went into the industry. We would visit job sites. And I just fell in love with the atmosphere on the job site and started learning about the construction world. And he made really good money as a young person who did odd jobs here and there. So that's really kind of how I got started.

But then honestly, for my career, overall, it's been very serendipitous. I will have to say that getting up early and getting to the job and doing your part is a big part of it. But I was what you call a job chaser. I was so enamored with all the different things that we could build. And I loved the aspect of being able to learn about every industry I built for. So, it was natural for me to say, oh, I really want to build a hospital. I'd really love to build a launch pad, or I really want to do an airport and then really kind of look for those opportunities where I could go and do those fun things and learn about those other industries.

Mary Killelea: That's fascinating. And I love that you kind of experience through growing up because I'm sure some women might be intimidated if they didn't have that early exposure and might not think that it was an industry for them. What are your thoughts on that?

Nancy Novak: Yeah, that is such a such a good point. It's if I hadn't had that introduction and exposure through my father, I don't know that it would have gone down this path. I mean, it's and found all the value in such a fascinating industry to work in. Because I also have to say, like, to your point about kind of having this advantage, you know, working with and for someone like my father kind of also set the bar for me and set the bar for what my expectations were and how I should be treated, how I should be welcomed, how I should be offered opportunities. And so many young women entering the field, that bar is not set for them. So, and even back in the old days, when I started out, there was a lot of this kind of, not implicit, but explicit bias that had to do with, hey, this is our this is our world. And if you want to fit into this world, you kind of have to put up with our stuff. I have the advantage of knowing that I didn't have to put up with that stuff. And even though I had plenty of challenges along the way, I always knew that the bar was set where it was set. And I really owe that to my exposure my dad gave me.

Mary Killelea: So let's talk about your chief innovation officer at Compass Datacenters. Can you tell us about your role there and what drives your passion around that position?

Nancy Novak: Oh, absolutely. This is like the best job on the planet. After 30 years of just building some of the most dynamic and cool things on the earth, I landed a job with Compass Datacenters. And instead of just running the work like I had done in the past, I get to be involved in disrupting the industry and being innovative. And what I love about it, and what I'm so excited about is the data center industry is the fourth industrial revolution. And so it is just exponentially growing. And it's so important that it does because it's just it's very similar to what Jeff Bezos coined years ago as comparing electricity to lighting that we used to, it was called lighting in the beginning because there was no other purpose for it. It was only used to light your home. And now electricity is needed and in all over the world.

Well, this is the fourth industrial revolution of digitizing everything on the planet. And what I what I really want to focus on here is the need to have this digital infrastructure and have it to where we to where the internet becomes a great equalizer and not the great divider, because the opportunities that it provides through data information, whether it's data transfer, data access, data transactions, and just knowledge is just immense. So I love being a part of that industry. And I like the kind of wash, rinse, repeat approach that the industry takes when it comes to building these large data centers, because it helps us try to perfect what we've been trying to perfect and change and disrupt the business and how we deliver our projects. So being plugged into the world of data is fantastic, understanding and knowing that this is a really noble and important thing to be able to do for the globe is also fantastic. And then being able to see the construction industry at this kind of crossroads where it's going to be able to pivot and really improve is also fantastic. And when I say improve, what I mean, Mary is I mean, improve through more diverse workforce, a more sustainable way to build and then also just really providing the opportunity on a global scale for people to have what they need to be successful.

Mary Killelea: It sounds like a fascinating role. How would someone who hears you and thinks, wow, I'd love to be in that realm of innovation. And I know that, you know, data centers are the future and where do they go to skill up and prepare themselves to be marketable to this industry?

Nancy Novak: So if we're talking, there's construction and then there's the digital infrastructure and they go hand in hand in my world. And I have to say it's typically if we're going to recruit for people who are going to be in our delivery teams and building, look at the traditional school of civil engineering or construction management. But honestly, here at Compass, we're very intentional about trying to provide opportunities to those who have never even thought of the industry. And I'm proud to say that in the US, we have 100% all female construction managers from coast to coast. And most of them, I will, at least half of them that I know of, had no prior experience. We have a very intentional way of bringing them in and making them fall in love with this industry. And they're just rock stars. I mean, they're crushing it.

So, I guess my advice to young people is like it's great to go through and get a formal education on something that interests you and construction is no different. But by all means, in this day and age where we've got more way more demand than we have supply, there are lots of opportunities that are out there looking for talent and entering at the beginning stages is fine. And mainly because I would like to tell people, even if you have a degree, you honestly learn everything on the job site. What we're looking for is a great attitude, some passion, and someone who loves what we do. That's really what we look for.

Mary Killelea: That's amazing. The stats about the women gave me chills. And I think that's fantastic. Do you think that there's intention? I mean, I'm sure there is because you don't achieve that without intention. Do you think that's because you're a woman, you saw the void and might have had challenges? Or what is the reason behind the intention of having that success metric?

Nancy Novak: I mean, I have to give our CEO Chris Pasby a lot of credit here because he also is a firm believer that we need to become more diverse. And nobody bats an eye when they say they have all men CMs. So, we wanted to be very intentional about making these opportunities available. And honestly, the duties that they have on the projects are duties that they excel in. They just excel. And then Chris's mind, he's like, what we need our CMs to do, the women are just really, really good at. So, he just really enjoys that. And we also we have we're in five different countries, and we have men who are also CMs in various locations. But we're just really proud to stay on that track of really being intentional about bringing women into the business who wouldn't have thought about it as a career path before.

Mary Killelea: That's amazing. And for those listening that aren't sure what CM stands for or like what a day in the life of a CM. Could you just highlight that?

Nancy Novak: Sure thing. So construction manager is what CM stands for. And for a company like ourselves, as a turnkey developer, we hire folks in these roles, and we'll have junior and senior duties for these people. And basically, what we look for is for them to be our eyes and ears on the job sites and to partner with our contractors and our design firms to really have a smooth delivery. And so they're there to like record things, do daily reports, meeting minutes, take photographs, and escalate when they need to. And then at a more senior level, you can do things like evaluate scope and entitlement and schedules and certain things like that. And then of course, as an innovation officer, I always have my special little projects that I tap my RCMs for, that they just do a wonderful job with whenever we need that kind of support. So they get a really wonderful and wide variety of a view of this business. And it's something that they feel like they're part of the family. We have very large campuses, our general contractors, our partners of ours, and RCMs are almost seamlessly woven in to the on-site team. So, it's like, it's very different, I would say, than most developers.

Mary Killelea: I just love, I love the programs that you're offering and the support and what I'm hearing. So I'm actually learning so much. And that's one of the bonuses of, you know, doing my own podcast. I invite speakers to come in who I find their jobs so fascinating, and I want to share it with the broader audience. So as a woman you mentioned it kind of softly in the beginning that rising up the ranks, you endured some challenges. Can you speak to any of the challenges or potentially advice on some of those challenges and how you overcame them so that others who might be faced with something similar could learn from you?

Nancy Novak: Yeah, I mean, it was a huge learning curve for me because it took me a long time to understand that statistically and just in society, women are received differently for having the same personality as their male counterparts. And in my case, I have a very strong personality. And so it was just difficult for me to watch my male counterparts deliver a message. And when I would do the same thing, it wasn't received in the same manner. So that was a big challenge for me to try to figure out and understand and not take personally. And that's the advice I'm trying to really give to your audiences. It is systemic and the biases that are implicit nowadays are not always done with ill intent. They just are what they are. And as humans, we all have biases. And it was hard for me to understand that as I was growing in my career.

And the other thing is, and I know that you and I talked about this before about this whole potential versus credential, but it's some of the best advice I can give is really to focus on looking at your colleagues and your peers and saying and seeing what kind of potential they have and the opportunities are getting and then look at yourself. And instead of like kind of being our own worst enemies and wanting to check every box and make sure that we have all the potential we need to move forward, put yourself up for those positions, knowing that you're going to learn what you need to do when you get there. I see this happen over and over, especially in our industry. And I'm the hot-culling, the middle black. I mean, I could run circles around most of my peers before I would finally kind of just put my foot down and say, it's time to move me along. And I really would love for the young women who are listening to just understand that your male counterparts aren't experts in their next step before they get to that step. They aren't. They never are. And they know that they'll have someone take them under the wing and show them the ropes and the business acumen that they need. And that's the person you need to look for. Instead of trying to check another box and get another credential, you put yourself out there and you say, I can learn on the job, just like my male counterparts as well or better. So that's the advice I would give.

Mary Killelea: Absolutely. Being your own advocate. And I love the potential mindset versus the credential mindset. So tell me about the boards that you sit on and how those opportunities came about.

Nancy Novak: So I do sit on a number of boards. And one of the most recent ones is I'm on the board of directors for a global environmental firm called Weston Solutions. And really, this is an important kind of story that I would like for the audience to grasp. And it is networking outside of our industry, networking in various women's groups where you learn, and you meet women who are interested in putting women on boards is important. So and this is what happened to me. For every venue I could go to that was outside of my industry, but it had to do with leadership and professional women. And of course, I learned and that many women who were interested in putting more women on boards, which I think is crucial for global economic development. And that's what happened in this case. I met a woman who owned a business who was just said you're a rock star, you need to be on a board. So, she put out a search. And within a couple of interviews, I landed this really wonderful board position. And I loved how it was so I was so in tune with the culture of this company. And in my background, lent itself to really being able to be a contributor at the board level. So that's the advice I have on that, how I got there, because this is a paid board position is just to really go out and Google it and find the venues and find the firms and the other people who are interested in supporting putting women on boards, because there's a lot of those firms are out there.

And then here's the thing, leading up to that I've been on a lot of non-paid board positions, but fairly prestigious boards were also like the things that I learned and the connections that I made were invaluable. So, one of the earlier boards I sat on was the National Women's Party board. And this is the original one that was developed in 1918 for the suffragette movement. And I just cannot stress enough how amazing and critical that board position was. I met so many of our women senators and congresswomen and everyone from Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Hillary Clinton, Laura Bush, and just fascinating venues because of the connection of this board. And the way I got on that board was I was at a women's conference, and I ran into the principal executive for General Powell, who became friends and she said, I need you on this board that I'm sitting on. And that's, and again, my point is that's how this happens. It is quite serendipitous, but if you put yourself out there, this is how these connections get made. No different than being on the National Institute of Building Sciences board as the vice chair of the BIM council. It was a friend who introduced me to the CEO of NIBs. And then also the World Trade Center Institute, which I just recently joined their board of directors. I've been a fan for many years and I belong to a group called Chief. And in Chief, it was just randomly the new CEO of the World Trade Center Institute reached out to me and said, would you mind speaking on one of our Agile series? And I said, sure. And I was like, oh, I just really enjoy what you guys do. And one thing led to another. Some this is some of this is like years of networking and some of it is just, you know, being in the right place at the right time and being open to these opportunities.

Mary Killelea: Yeah. You know, that's so wonderful. And I honestly, myself personally, am taking notes because that is an aspiration of mine. And I love hearing how these came about, because sometimes you don't know what you don't know. Thank you for sharing that. Yeah, my pleasure. Okay. So let's talk about mentors. We know that young professionals benefit from mentors or sponsors. What is your advice to, you know, someone in their mid-career on advocating for themselves to say, I think part of the thing with career people that are young and don't have mentors, it's like, I don't know how to get one.

Nancy Novak: And honestly, the how to is the difficult part. You've nailed it. You just hit it right on the head. And I know that people play around with words like sponsor, mentorship and advocacy. And one thing I do like to point out is you can have a mentor who's a good sounding board, but may not be able to advocate for you because they don't have the power to do so. Right. So, make sure you understand the difference between like having someone who's a wonderful sounding board and can help guide you or like basically be your, be the person who can be your mirror. Right. That's fantastic. And I would look for mentors inside and outside of our industry people who just impressed you both men and women, but, but if you're looking for advocacy, which is someone who's sitting in the decision-making rooms and, and they've got your back, that's a whole other thing. And, and this is a hard one, especially for women in male dominated industries, because as humans we gravitate towards those that we know and remind us of ourselves and are similar to what we have experienced. So organic conversations are the best way to gain the closeness you need to get an advocate, not just doesn't really understand what your career has looked like or what boxes that you've checked, but also understand your aspirations and your management style. And all of the things that go into making you the leader that you're becoming. Right. And the way to do that is typically organic conversations where you're not in a professional setting, having to just work in a meeting with your team or, you know, or basically like a resume format.

And it's so funny because I have a few tips on how to do this. And I was telling this to some of my male managers a few years back. And, and one of them called me up and he says, Oh my God, Nancy, I know exactly what you're talking about, about that whole organic conversation. And sure enough, he had done some PGA tour with one of the senior VPs. And he said we were just talking and some location came up. And I mentioned that I had done a job there. And then right away the EVP said, Oh, really? I didn't know you had done that. And he said, yeah, I've moved this many times. And then of course, the EVP looked over at his colleague and he said, well, how many times have you moved for the company? And the colleague gave an answer. And this gentleman calls me and he says, it was so nice to be able to have this conversation to explain to the senior person kind of what my path would look like without me having to go in and like hand my resume over and say, look, here's what I've done, you know? And the other thing is like when I was in late my career, I was able to go on ski trips with a group of senior executives. And I was the only female for like, I think seven years of that. And it was super important to me, because it wasn't just about getting that advocacy. It was kind of where I was going to be in that particular company. And it was about like, having this peer group that felt really comfortable calling each other, picking up the phone. And honestly, in this particular group, there was a general superintendent who was the reason I came back in after I had retired to help the company pursue large multi-billion dollar pursuits, because, he was like, I know, I just don't, I don't want to do this unless Nancy comes in to help us. And for me, that was a huge, huge compliment, but it just shows you the value of getting to know people on both a personal and professional level. So, I know I talked a long time, but I just want to stress how important that is and how hard it can be. And so, companies that are maybe listening need to understand they need to make these opportunities available for, you know, inter, multi-gender, organic conversations that aren't just on the golf course or just on the fishing boat, but in other ways, right?

Mary Killelea: Absolutely. Absolutely. Let's talk about career strategy. Did you start your career with a strategy and know where you wanted to go because you knew the business, you know, kind of from the family, and, or did you discover it and kind of take twists and turns, take lateral moves or what has been your, your story?

Nancy Novak: So I always knew that I wanted to, to, to build stuff. And initially, I started out on a lot of military installations, and I really did enjoy working on these military bases. But I have to say in the beginning, I really didn't have any idea the, the opportunities around there to build some of the most amazing things that, that, you know, we have in our, in our country. And so for me, it was kind of, the path was as I continue to learn and build, I would look around and I would see what was happening within the company or other companies. And I would say if they can do it, I can do it. If that person can do it, I know I can do it. And I just didn't set any limits on myself. And I was, and it was so confident because it wasn't just because I thought it was better or I had better credentials, because I didn't, but I could see in my peer group that these were talented individuals, but I knew that I had just as much talent and just as much drive.

So that, that was one of those things that just kept me going and then allowed me to really, you know, stretch. And I have to say, like, probably the biggest stretch I did was when I was chasing the launch pads to go build the Atlas V program for Lockheed. It took a year and a half. It took a lot of money, a lot of effort, and it was kind of nerve wracking because if I wasn't successful, that would, that wouldn't bode well for my career. But I had a lot of support and, and, you know, that particular pursuit ended up landing the district. And now that company is the largest aerospace builder in the nation. So very exciting stuff, but, you know, having that support mattered.

Mary Killelea: Have you found it okay within your career to ask for help?

Nancy Novak: I have, I absolutely have. And you know what's the greatest thing is, my male counterparts love to give help. They love being asked for help. I mean, all, anybody, humans love being asked for help. I like it when people ask me for help, you know? So, I 100%, you know, promote and encourage people to ask for help. And it's, it's really, really important when you're given an assignment to not feel intimidated by saying, Hey, I know I can do this, but I just, I have to ask for help. I need a little guidance. And I have another story to put people at ease over this, because women, again, we have this tendency, and it's because of how society teaches us not being able to say that I don't know, because, you know, then, then there's a bunch of shade thrown your way. So I have one young manager who had been promoted to a brand new manager and he reports into the headquarters and he says, Hey, I need what, what do you want me to work on? And I was like, well, let's put together an instrument agreement, kind of gave him some instructions and shoved him into a little cubicle and said here you go. And about two hours went by and I went by to go check on him. And he said, you're going to want to be manager. And I said, what do you mean? And he said, I have no idea what he’s asking me. And I said, Oh, no problem at all. Let me give you examples and show, and it's not a problem, but it's interesting because when I would have the same experience with our young women, they didn't feel like they were able to say that it was very confident, like, I mean, and he was great, did a great job, by the way. So, I use that story with a lot of the women's networking events that I hosted so that they would understand that it's okay not to know everything and it's absolutely okay to ask for help.

Mary Killelea: Yeah. That's fantastic. So, I want to plug your podcast, Breaking Glass. Tell us about who you have on and the conversations that you have.

Nancy Novak: Well, I've had a lot of amazing women on the podcast who are just, you know, really, you know, groundbreaking in their careers. Some of my favorite friends who are who were very high up in some of the clients that we work with would be Heather Dooley or Noel Walsh, who have worked for the big hyper scalers. And the reason why I bring them up is because they definitely have gone through the career path in a similar manner to what I did in a very male dominated environment. And their advice is just, it's just off the charts, wonderful. It's so endearing to be able to have colleagues who you can relate to who are also very interested in spreading that knowledge to the larger group. And I think it's so important for all of us and it's incumbent upon us to really reach down and bring along our fellow women so that we can get more parity in the women and the economy, basically. It's important for a lot of reasons. It's important because our industry needs it. It's important because every industry needs it, honestly, but our industry desperately needs it to be more innovative, to do what we have to do, to have the proper amount of talent. And then it's also just important when you look at the global economy, the pie gets bigger when you have more diversity and you provide more opportunity. So, and this is again, very factual, very, very strong business case. So what we're trying to do is have this ripple in the pond, you know, with the Breaking Glass podcast, where we can invite women from various associations, different walks of life and different experience levels, and really be able to share, you know, what they've learned with our audience.

Mary Killelea: I love it. And I'll be sure to include that in the show notes. Let's talk about advocacy or self-advocacy. You know, talking about pay and equity is somewhat taboo. Any advice for women when they're trying to advocate for themselves around pay?

Nancy Novak: I do have advice there. And you're right, it's a difficult conversation. But my advice is, when you're going after a position or you're entering negotiations with a company, absolutely look for the professionals and a way in which you can network by asking others what they know the market will bear. I'm very generous when it comes to offering this information, because I feel like it will make a big difference in how we can close the pay gap. And the other thing is, it's not always just the pay gap. Sometimes it's the promotion gap, right? It's the women who stay in one spot for too long for reasons that seem to be justified that are not. And so in our industry, we might have women who are in certain roles who are paid equal to their peers, but they should be in roles two or three levels above at that point in their career. So I think again, you know, that would be, I would say Mary, we're a mentor would be great, right? An advocate too, but a mentor would be great to be able to bounce those kinds of things off of and saying, you know, what have you seen in the market? What do you know the market will bear? You know, what do you think about this?

And then the last piece of advice is, if you can get equity, get it. And equity is a wonderful thing to have in your career. It's better than just having what's on your check. And a lot of that has to do with basically the culture of the company and like kind of being a part of something bigger that's growing. So, equity is always a really nice thing to have and always ask about it.

Mary Killelea: Great advice. So you're very successful. What drives you and your success?

Nancy Novak: I actually think I've asked myself this many times and I call myself a continuous learner. I like to get juiced up in the morning. I like to feel like I'm a part of something bigger than myself. I like to continue learning. So learning about all the different businesses that we've worked with or worked for or being plugged in to these cutting edge ways that the globe is changing and being on these different boards that have all these amazing initiatives is something that just brings me alive every day. I love having the facts over, the demographics on the globe and understanding the technologies that we have today that can really pivot and help us with things like climate change and this whole idea behind getting more equity and understanding what that means to the global economy. So for me, I think it's more about this continuous learning. And then construction is just, you get to meet the smattering of all walks of life. You get to meet the person with the tool in their hand, which I highly respect. And I start all my innovative ideas with that person in mind and all the way up through to the architects, engineers, and owners and the variety of business and industry sectors that you talk with. It's just fascinating. And I just, and you never get bored. You can just never get bored.

Mary Killelea: Yeah, I love it. Your passion is so palpable. How do you or what advice do you give women who are in roles that they're not passionate about, but yet there is something passionate? So like, let's say technology. I think sometimes we get so in into what we're doing that we lose sight of what it's enabling. And I think there's a way for women to find passion if they understand the deeper meaning of what they do. Would you agree?

Nancy Novak: I would, I would totally agree. I really do agree with that. And looking for those, looking for that and really reminding yourself of that is one thing. I also think that, again, kind of going outside of your industry to see how your industry is affecting others is a way to learn what your contribution is. And then it's the old, really old adage that I like to bring up is, you know, whenever you're doing a job, and I used to tease my kids about this, and the job could be, you know, putting your clothes away or it could be folding towels, it could be just anything mundane. When you do a really good job of it, it's very satisfying. So whatever you're doing, I don't care if it's you're writing a daily report or you're producing something for your boss, you're putting a spreadsheet together. Just try to like literally just tell yourself I just want to do a really good job. I'm going to color code these things. I'm going to organize this. I'm going to make the font really bright. And I'm going to be able to put a little color on this, and in the daily so that they understand what I through my eyes and what I'm experiencing here. And I'm telling you, that leaves that more satisfying and brings the passion back. But people can see that and it's cheap.

Mary Killelea: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Okay. So what does to be bolder mean to you?

Nancy Novak: Well, so in the topic that we've been on Mary, that to be bolder for me is literally not putting any limits on yourself. And it's knowing that that not only, not it's knowing that not only you have no limits, but that you can do any job as good or better than your male counterparts. And you can do it differently. You don't have to do it the same way. That's what being bolder means to me.

Mary Killelea: That's fantastic. You're fantastic. I have loved this conversation. Before we close, is there anything that you want to leave with the audience that we might not have touched on today?

Nancy Novak: Well, I mean, I just want to tell your audience that, please like look me up on LinkedIn. I'm a very responsive person. I like to learn from the audiences that I speak to as much as they get from me. And so, I would love feedback and please share, share, share, because that ripple in the pond is what makes a rising tide lift all board.

Mary Killelea: Thank you so much for all that you do for women and for being on the show.

Nancy Novak: I appreciate you. Thanks so much, Mary.

Mary Killelea: Thanks for listening to the episode today. It was really fun chatting with my guest. If you liked our show, please like it and share it with your friends. If you want to learn what we're up to, please go check out our website at 2bbolder.com. That's the number two, little b, bolder.com.